Invisible to Invincible Podcast: Marketing and Branding for High Achievers

Hello friends.

I'm Kendra Losee from KendraLosee.com
and you've tuned in to the Invisible to

Invincible podcast where unapologetically
driven business owners share their journey

from hidden gems to industry leaders.

Together, we'll uncover the
secrets, mental shifts, and

business strategies that turn
hidden gems into undeniable forces.

So hit that subscribe
button and let's dive in.

Our guest today is Dr.

Amanda Bell.

Amanda has a Ph.

D.

and Educational Policy.

What this has meant for her is that she
knows a lot about data, how to collect

it, and how to make it meaningful
for organizations and individuals.

Her company, Context Matters, is on
a mission to spread the word that

data can be a form of compassion.

Amanda has been doing organizational
effectiveness and developmental

research for the past 15 years.

She is a certified life coach
because she knows that someone can

have the best data, But not get to
the point that they're using it.

She works with individuals
and organizations to reimagine

their relationship to work.

Welcome, Amanda.

It's great to have you here.

I am so glad to be here.

I always love talking
about all things business.

Fantastic.

So you have a business
called Context Matters.

And clearly we're talking today
about practicing compassion

with time tracking and I am so
fascinated by both of those topics.

So can you start by telling
us a little bit about your

business and when you started it?

Sure.

I started my business in
um, in August of 2021.

When I filled out the paperwork, um,
on the state's website to get my LLC.

Um, and I, I, it would be really funny to
sit next to that version of myself because

she would be completely flabbergasted
that, um, I'm doing now what I am doing.

Um, and, um, yes.

And yes, so what was the motivation
to start your own business?

Because it's such a big leap,
especially with your background

and the places you've worked.

So I have worked for about
15 years in academia around

organizational development.

And I like to say that, like, my career
has basically, basically been around

measuring things that are hard to measure.

Um, and I have.

Brilliant.

Loved it.

I, if I had again, a version
of me in my like early twenties

would also be flabbergasted.

So I have two degrees in humanities
and my plan, like my plan was

to get a PhD in art history.

Like I used to study new
media art and psychoanalysis.

Art history, while it does have a lot
of facts, is a little bit different than

data and organizational development.

And so that's where all of my
compassion stuff and my different

perspective on data comes in.

Because it is, it's like, I, one
conversation that I need to have somewhere

is about visual language and, and
about the information that is in that.

Um, but the reason why I ended up doing
the work I'm doing is because I realized

that I wanted to, like, make a difference.

I wanted to have an impact on how.

Change happens, essentially, um,
which is what has motivated me to

help motivated me to understand,
um, what pieces come into play when

it comes to organizational change,
personal development, things like that.

Um, and, um, I promise the
humanities and art history background

really helps with that part.

I'm sure it does.

It's always fascinating.

One of the things that I've always said
that I love about marketing and business

is that it's the combination of you
get the science side and the analytical

plus the creative in order to like solve
problems and communicate with people.

Well, and the thing about data
is, um, I had a mentor once.

We probably didn't even know she was
a mentor, but she said so many things

that I was just like, Oh my God.

So in part of measuring things that are
hard to measure is building rubrics.

I don't like to call them rubrics
because they have a bad name because

we've all had bad experiences with them.

It's basically trying to
qualify what success looks like.

Um, and you know, it's like if you
think about like good, right, this,

um, whatever, uh, good, better,
best, or something like that.

That's a bad example.

But, and the, the story that she told
was that when she was working in academic

departments, she would go to like the
chemistry faculty and in a rubric,

you can write words in the boxes.

Like you can say good, or it
can be like a scale of a one.

And so she'd go to the chemistry
department and they're like,

We don't care if it's good.

Just give us the number.

Like we want to know if
they're a one or a five.

Um, and then she'd go to like
the art faculty and they would be

like, we don't want these numbers.

We just want the words like we want
to know if they're good or excellent.

And there's a huge difference
between good and excellent.

And so that's the thing about data.

And that's where I think kind of thinking
about it in different frames comes into

place is that there are Like there has
been a bit of a tyranny is a bit of a

strong word, but I'm going to use it
tyranny around what data is, who gets

to interpret it, how to do it, but
really it's just a bunch of rules that

are less exact than one might think.

think.

Um, and so when you kind of
look at them more holistically,

rigorously, of course, right?

I'm not doing anything
unethical or whatever.

It really starts to broaden the
picture of what data can, and I say

it like this, feel like in your body.

Because most people experience it of like
something that's very separate from them.

Like for a while, I was doing a
lot of research around a concept

called mathematical self efficacy,
which is basically the idea of

how good we think we are at math.

And that how good we think we are at math
actually predicts how good we are at math.

It's like not a chicken or egg.

It's like that.

Belief in ourselves.

Um, so that then kind of really starts
to narrow down who can and can't,

can, let's see, can and can't do math.

Isn't that part of the like, well
first, I love that quote by Henry Ford

that's whether you think you can or
you think you can't, it's you're right.

And then the second thing is that
isn't that part of like the problem why

they had to recall that one, Barbie.

Like a million years ago that
was like math is hard, right?

Yes.

I mean, but what's so funny about
that generation of girls who are

playing with that Barbie to think
that math is hard so we can't do math

and recalling the Barbie didn't help.

No, of course not.

Of course not.

I mean, the Barbie was not
actually the problem there.

And that is why context matters, right?

We think the Barbie is the problem,
but it's actually the, you know, like.

As an art historian, you know, looking
at the ways in which photographs were

taken, for example, um, like there's
ho so much more to the picture.

Mm-Hmm.

of a phenomenon than we really
are able to give it credit.

It's so interesting 'cause whenever, and
I know I wanna talk about you and your

story and your personal brand and all
that too, but first I wanna talk about

data here for a second because it all
goes into the mindset and the beliefs

that people have about themselves.

Because when you start to look at.

Data.

Like, for example, I was doing some
research for my program to teach

women how to, women business owners
specifically, how to use live video.

And one of the stats I came across
was like video is 60 times, 60,

000 times more effective and you
can build deeper learnings and

connections with people than text.

So I started chasing down that fact
through the rabbit hole of the internet,

as one does, and ended up in like,
entrepreneur India, and then that had,

you know, and it ended up nowhere, right?

Like that fact and chasing that fact
just basically took a couple hours out

of my life, but didn't take me anywhere
other than I'm not going to use that fact

because there wasn't any basis behind it.

So I think that it's really easy
for us to find those facts online

and say, okay, this is happening.

So this is what we see.

So this is what we perceive.

So there's a woman who has started a
company named, her name is Heather Krause

and her company is called We All Count.

And she has a data equity
framework that points to what

you're talking about, which is.

To kind of ask questions of information
that we're collecting so that we can get a

better sense of where it's coming from in
terms of who's saying it, how it's funded,

how they came up with the information,
because what you're talking about.

In, in terms of the long term for me,
my, my own personal, you know, want

to say brand or mission is to empower
more folks to understand that there are

frameworks like that, that they can use
to empower themselves to be a data user.

Because the fact is people who are
data people just have sometimes the

guts to like stand up for something
because they think they have a

rationale that's going to support them.

So like, As soon as you have a rationale
and like you have at least like two

layers of of like support you're just
as much of a smart data person as like

the economists that I've worked with.

That's so interesting because it's
always interesting that When you can

look at data and one of the things
that I always talk to business owners

about is because there's a lot of when
you look online and when you look on

YouTube and when you look on TikTok
and the social media platforms, right?

There's a lot of younger faces that
are business owners and they're

promoting their business and awesome.

I love that.

It's great for them.

But when you look at the data, most
business owners are over the age of 40.

And so there's a yes.

Yes.

Also, also male.

So when you start to look at like the
top voices and the top people, it's,

you're seeing male faces and you're
seeing older male faces and younger, you

know, and then the women are typically
seeing younger female faces because

they're, they're not afraid of technology.

And then it creates that perception of.

This is all I see.

This is who that's for, and
that is an incorrect perception.

And so when you start to look at
that data or, you know, those like

internal studies that people do,
how do you, how do you help people?

Unwind that because it's
not necessarily data point.

It's one that collected in their head.

So one of I so one of the things that I do
most in my work, either with organizations

or individuals is mapping mindset.

Let's see.

Mindset and underlying beliefs.

Two practices.

Um, so that we take what you call
those like internal data points and

we put them up against something else.

Like in the qualitative research
world, it's called triangulation.

Um, and so it's this idea that,
um, okay, so let's first verbalize.

This is true.

You know, let's say there are only
younger women who are starting businesses.

So then it's like, okay, all
right, let's be nice to myself.

Let's either be, let's,
let's be nice to myself.

Let's go see where there
are a couple places.

Um, and then to kind of think
about where are these places

coming up with their information?

Um, so that you can create a more
holistic picture of what is true.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's really interesting.

Now I have a question for you
about starting your own business.

Given all of this, and given your
propensity for planning and organization

and leaving academia, which is, I've
been in academia as well, it can be

very stable and people that go there
can stay there for a lifetime basically.

What made you decide, what was your
motivation to start your own business

and to be able to practice all of this?

Um, honestly, my motive, lots of
different motivations, actually get

my boss to fire me so that I could
get severance and it didn't work.

Um, but I, um, One thing is that I knew
I was meant to do bigger and greater

things and that it was very clear
where I was working given my, the way I

look as well as my approach was not as
welcome as I needed it to be to continue.

Um, so I like owed it to myself to
believe in myself essentially and in my

experience the best way to to Learn how
to believe in myself is to do things

that show me that I believe in myself.

That's really powerful because I
think that one of the things that I

run into a lot is people who believe
in their self, they, they have this

feeling that they were meant for
more, but they either don't act on it.

They don't, you know, and then
the reasons why they don't

act on it are varied, right?

Time, money, beliefs that they can't.

All of those things,
the risk is too great.

That kind of approach.

So the fact that you did, especially
being the planner coming from a very

stable type of place into this unknown.

Did you know how unknown
business ownership would be?

I mean, literally, I, uh.

I didn't want to leave my job until I had
like at least gotten a couple clients and

like made a plan of like what my financial
picture would look like six months down

the road, what my client structure would
look like and, uh, you know, within

an hour that like went out the window.

I mean, it wasn't an hour because
I probably would have freaked

out and like put the brakes on.

Um, but the version of my business now, I
mean, I even I Anyways, the version of my

business now is categorically different
than what it was in August of 2021.

And how do you feel about that?

Oh, I have lots of feelings about that.

Um, you know, what I keep coming
back to is that I choose, I

still choose this every day.

And that, um, I am glad I didn't
know then what I know now.

Um, because it's.

It was, it would have been too much.

It would have been too overwhelming.

And I am a person that for better or
worse, I have to learn things on my own.

Like no one can tell me,
Oh, this will be this way.

I'll be like, sure.

Great.

Thanks.

But I have to do it.

Right.

Um, and one of the things that I have
had to kind of settle into in terms of

Where I am now versus where I was then.

And this goes to time tracking actually
is so one of the first times I tracked

my time, um, I felt like shit because
I looked at my time and I was spending

so much time like talk, like meeting
with other entrepreneurial women or

in coaching or um, on walks by myself.

And then after sort of the shame spiral
went away, what I have come to realize is

that being the person that I am, building
my business is as much about building

me as it is about building my business.

And so I had left a marriage or I
got divorced a number of years ago.

And when I left my marriage, I didn't
really have a network of folks.

And so in order to have this,
the, the supports and the.

I don't like the word resilience,
but in order to have what I

needed for this business, that
was something I had to build.

And I had to have compassion for
myself that it didn't look the way

I thought it was supposed to, right?

Like I wasn't churning out content five
hours at least every day, but that I was

spending at least two hour, you know,
five to 10 hours a week with colleagues,

mentors, those sorts of things.

And that, that was what.

I needed in my business at the time,
isn't it amazing how we get to the

same place I've been talking about.

I did several lives earlier this
year and I was talking about how

what we think is going to, it
needs to be this perception, right?

Like all those videos about the
perfect morning routine for business

of successful people or whatever those
perceptions are of what we think we need.

We still get back to
what we actually need.

And one of the things that I really was
focusing on earlier was, I was really

successful in my corporate career,
you know, academia and corporate,

however you want to describe it.

When I started my own business, I had no
idea the mindset work that I had not done.

That needed to be done.

And that is absolutely a journey
that's changed everything in terms

of what I do, how I approach stuff.

And I think it was always there,
like these ideas that I have, but

they were just so buried down.

Because it's easy to bury stuff
down when you keep yourself

busy 60 plus hours a week.

Well, there's a difference between
thinking something and actually doing it.

Like we can convince ourselves that we
think something and we think something

is going to work, but it's a whole
other thing when we actually embody it.

Absolutely.

So back to time tracking
here for a second.

One of the things that I was talking to
Amanda about before we went live is that,

um, you know, it was really interesting
because I was working so much when I

first started and I was so exhausted
because I had these beliefs where I went

from being like a VP at a university
and their marketing department and then,

you know, running agency departments.

And when I started my own business, I
had this belief that I didn't know Like

I needed to get my hands dirty again to
truly understand how to best help clients.

And so I was constantly listening
to podcasts, trying to update my

brain, trying to learn everything
I could and work with clients.

And I just, I was exhausted all the time.

And it wasn't until I pulled out
and just did a couple days of time

tracking because my ADHD doesn't
love many days of time tracking.

Um, but I found that I
wasn't taking breaks.

I thought I was taking like half
hour, 45 minute breaks and just

like squirreling away time, but it
was really like five or 10 minutes.

And then the amount of time I thought
that I was like relaxing, walking my dog,

I was actually listening to podcasts and
things that would help me for my business.

And so my actual down and creative time
that actually, and that we all need

to recharge was down to like some, it
was something stupidly embarrassing.

So we're not going to talk
about it, but just understanding

the importance of looking at.

Where we're spending our time looking at
how we treat ourselves once we find that.

Can you talk a little bit about
some of your insights and working

with clients around that area?

So one of the things that I
do for everything is I adopt.

I've adopted what I call
a values neutral lens.

So from a data perspective,
it's that there's no bad.

There's nothing there, no
wrong or broken things.

There's only places that
we can ask more questions.

And so.

Because one of the things that I
get often, um, so the, I've started

calling it the conscious calendar.

So it's the idea of being a conscious
business owner and building our

calendar around that is that Um, most
folks are like, I really just don't,

I don't, like, I don't want to see it.

Like, if I don't look at it, then
maybe it won't feel so shitty.

Um, and the thing about it is, is
that, um, it's also an experience

to be in a place where you get to
be accepted and compassionate about.

Everything you do.

Like, of course you didn't get to
work until 10 o'clock because your

child didn't sleep the night before.

Or like, of course, like, you
only worked for three hours that

day, but like, in that three hour,
like, just one day this week.

I could not seem to sit down and work.

I, like, was in my feelings, and
had some tears around some things,

and called a friend, and took a nap,
and probably did something else.

I was feeling really shitty about myself,
but then I happened to sit down at my

desk before going out into the woods
because I love being in the woods and

picked up the phone and called this person
who's like been in the back of my head.

I haven't talked to
you in like five years.

Um, but I was like, I, I heard
something was going on in her

organization and You know, just
on a whim, I called, called her.

I'm not a fan of calling people.

It's not my favorite.

And I've never done something
like this before in my life.

Picked up the phone.

She answered.

I have a meeting with her in three weeks.

So it was like, so this is one picture of
like, Yeah, I probably did 30 minutes of

work that day, but the 30 minutes of work
that I did in terms of entrepreneurial

work is going to be like a potential
really great lead generation for me.

Wesley's really, my dog's really excited
about you doing that, by the way.

I'm so glad.

Me too.

But I think it's an opportunity to
really reframe this idea of like,

what our calendars should look like.

So it's like to take off that
lens of like, okay, one, I'm

going to see that I'm bad.

Two, I'm going to see that I didn't
work enough to kind of scale that back.

And one of the things I like to think
about is one, first, let's talk about what

are the things that are Uh, part of your
capacity, like what are things that you

have to have capacity for on a regular
day, you know, and I love working with

women entrepreneurs because oftentimes,
you know, it's like that list of things

that we're keeping track of with our kids
all of the time, or like doing laundry or

all of that sort of hidden labor that we
talk about that we really don't account

for when we think about how we're doing.

It's like I have one client, you
know, Who's actually a coach and,

you know, she did the whole process.

She tracked her time.

I also analyze a good Google
calendar to get a more historical

analysis so that time tracking
part doesn't have to be so painful.

And then I also analyze an interview
and like after the whole process,

she was like, you know what?

I didn't even write down where
I was responding to my clients

either over text or email.

I was doing all of that other work and
I didn't put it in any of this, right?

Um, so yeah, I could talk about this
forever because there's just in terms

of broadening out that picture of like
context matters when we talk about time.

I mean, it's like Salesforce.

I think it's the company that has
everyone's hourly rate in their

calendar invites, which I think.

you know, meetings, you know, we've all
been in those meetings, but like, that

is one way of looking at time, but there
also needs to be another like, okay, like,

what is the quality of my participation?

What is the quality of the
container that we're looking at?

That is just a bigger picture in
terms of what we track around time.

That's super interesting, especially
with, like I said, I've had a lot of

clients that are similar with me with
ADHD where the idea of tracking something,

like you actually have to do it.

And it's like becomes this monolithic
thing of like, okay, I'm only

going to do it for these days.

But then to your point, like one of
the things that I took away from.

from time blocking because I got tired
of moving all the blocks around, but I

kept the ones where I have to walk my dog
and do my morning process in the morning.

And I have to walk my dog in the evenings.

Like these are the non
negotiable time blocks of time.

And then everything else
has to fit in there.

Cause after that, I'm not, you know,
unless I do yoga in the morning and

then, you know, things shift around,
but the dog walk time absolutely stays

because that's, it has to happen.

It's non negotiable and it's
something I enjoy doing.

It's just so fascinating.

Yeah.

And I think the, you know, I, um, have,
I talk about time all of, all of the

time, and I encounter a lot of people
who either say, like, I cannot hear

one more time management anything, or
please don't tell me to time block.

And the thing about this idea of having
compassion and like the conscious calendar

is that One of the things that we have not
really been, that has not been normalized

for us is really having the ability to
create a baseline of what is real for us

versus what we think we should be doing.

That's really interesting.

And for people who want to know more about
that, how can they reach you, Amanda?

So my website is contextmatters.

work.

Um, right now I'm in the
process of changing the name.

There's a page it's backslash time audit
for what I'm now calling the conscious

calendar because I think it makes sense.

Does more justice to it.

Um, and then I'm also on Instagram where
I like to play around probably too much.

Um, at Amanda underscore context
matters and the links will be below.

And if you are listening to this,
they'll be in the show notes and you

can find and reach out to Amanda because
I know I am really curious about the

conscious calendar because anything
that can go with the flow of how I work

versus me feeling like I have to like
set these huge guardrails of shame.

Like if you go over it, Don't go over it.

I want to know what the guardrails
of shame would look like.

Like, would they be
like giant chain fences?

Um, I pictured, yeah, I kind of
pictured, so I'm located in San

Diego, so I did picture a little bit
of that Mexican California border.

Right?

Like, that's a really big guardrail.

I'm not talking about like little bumpers
on the side of Yeah, like a bling.

Yeah, like I'm talking about like giant
guardrails of shame where if you like

don't go over this or if you don't do this
thing, all of a sudden that shame hits.

And as a business owner, I think it's
really hard for us as a woman business

owner, I think it's hard for us to let
go of those things that we're supposed

to do because the list of things we are
supposed to do is so overwhelming that a

lot of times we find ourselves adding more
to it when it doesn't need to be there.

Yes, 100%.

There are lots of books
that can help with that too.

Everything.

Fantastic.

Amanda, this has been so
great having you here.

I really appreciate you.

Being a fantastic guest and those of you
listening, absolutely tune in, follow

Amanda, find her, learn more about the
conscious calendar, because it sounds

like it can just do a tremendous amount
of help for all of us as business

owners and, you know, corporate people
too, because it's just so powerful and

no matter how you look at your time,
how you look at data, how you look

at the things that you're perceiving.

That are working against you when
actually you can work with it.

There's no against, times a thing.

So thank you all for joining.

Amanda, thank you, thank you, thank you
for being here and being so patient.

It's been fantastic.

And until next time, I'm
Kendra Losee and thank you.